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Poll: Is Occupy Wall Street Going Too Far? [GALLERY]

Demonstrators blocking traffic have already been arrested. Is movement going overboard?

The Occupy Wall Street movement entered what is promising to be the most contentious day yet on Thursday.

Demonstrators have vowed to "shut down Wall Street," blocking traffic on major roadways leading to the financial district. Police have already arrested some protestors who were sitting, blocking traffic. The crowd was reportedly chanting "all day, all week, shut down Wall Street."

The newest developments come after the city and park owners had tents and sleeping bags removed on Tuesday.

Demonstrators have vowed to block traffic on the Brooklyn Bridge, among other avenues to the financial center.

As the day's events unfold, we ask you: are protestors going to far? Does blocking roadways hurt more than just those working on Wall Street, and will it have an adverse affect on the economy? Is that, in your opinion, a good thing? Is it necessary for the protestors to do so in reaction to their encampment being taken down?

Tell us how you feel in our poll, then let us know why you voted how you did in the comments.

Marina Kennedy November 21, 2011 at 01:43 AM
20-25 working 2 jobs to support a small business and volunteering in urban centers near my home, cooking for and driving senior citizens to medical appointments, organizing programs for the disabled......the same that I expect of my children and OWS protesters.
Jo November 21, 2011 at 01:56 AM
Marina - I applaud you for going beyond your own needs to extend help to others, when it would be very easy to justify not doing so. I've learned that there are many different kinds of "ministries" -- from charity, to 1-on-1 assisting, to working in social services, to advocacy, to protest, and more. We are all good at different things. It's just important to do SOMETHING toward making people's lives better. It's a little like a potluck: with enough people bringing a dish, the buffet table always turns out fulfilling.
Marina Kennedy November 21, 2011 at 02:59 AM
All the best to you and your advocacy!!!
Meredith Mascitello November 21, 2011 at 03:37 PM
Mike, The judge ruled they could continue to protest, but could not sleep or set up camp in the park. I have no problem with that. Occupying 24/7 is squatting which is illegal and not covered under the 1st amendment.
Meredith Mascitello November 21, 2011 at 03:51 PM
My point Gary is that the money we earn is ours and we subsidize the government. The money does not belong to the government first. When the rich get a tax break it means they are paying less of their own money. It is not the govt giving them more. Why is someone demanding the govt pay for housing or forgive student loans not greedy? They are demanding their fellow citizens pay for them. How is that not greedy?
Meredith Mascitello November 21, 2011 at 04:06 PM
Jo, What you are advocating is a form of Socialism or Communism. One reason we have reached this point is that govt has grown too massive. It is too large to keep corruption from running rampant. Look back at history and see that the more we try to have the govt solve our social problems, the greater they actually become. The war on poverty has given us more poverty and made it generational. Social security has given our country less security because it has created a massive amount of federal debt. We don't live in a jungle, but we have a Federal govt not a National govt. It is not the role of the Federal govt to have social programs. If the States wish to do so, they can.
Meredith Mascitello November 21, 2011 at 05:06 PM
Gary, you are deflecting. You did not answer the question regarding where we are going to get the money from. You can't. It doesn't exist. We have to cut our spending.
MadInNJ November 21, 2011 at 09:58 PM
This video says it all - http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-november-16-2011/occupy-wall-street-divided
Jo November 21, 2011 at 10:32 PM
I'm not sure how you interpreted the Samantha Bee segment (which I thought was hysterical), but I hope it didn't "prove" some negative ideas you may have. It was a comedy skit, and it had some truth in it (as good comedy does). Since I've been there a few times (not to sleep, just to engage), I'd be glad to give you some first-hand observations.
Jo November 21, 2011 at 10:33 PM
I'm not sure how you interpreted the Samantha Bee segment (which I thought was hysterical), but I hope it didn't "prove" some negative ideas you may have. It was a comedy skit, and it had some truth in it (as good comedy does). Since I've been there a few times (not to sleep, just to engage), I'd be glad to give you some first-hand observations.
MadInNJ November 21, 2011 at 10:51 PM
Observe away, but alas, it was not a skit. Those were real OWSers and their honest opinions about each other, the "movement," and how even the 99%ers stratify themselves. I would also be intesrested in hearing more about the the distinction between "personal" and "private" property as noted by the iPad Guy around the 4:30 mark.
Jo November 21, 2011 at 10:55 PM
Meredith (I would have preferred to add this as a Reply, but couldn't find your comment when I went to the Patch site) - I don't talk in "isms", and I have no allegiance to any. There are as many interpretations of them as those who use them. I feel they are just a convenient way to put someone's views in some kind of box, which short-circuits dialogue. Your "over-sized govt" argument has some merit, but is a red herring in this whole Occupy discussion. It's not the size that has created our current systemic problems - it's the fact that it has been corrupted. Look around & you'll find several nations with small, yet corrupt, governments. My purpose & goal is to find ways to fix govt so that it works for everyone's benefit. One sign of a civilized, advanced and healthy society is a generous abundance of compassion & caring. There are some things that just one person can't accomplish alone. I invite you to evolve to a higher plain.
Madison Cyclist November 21, 2011 at 11:17 PM
Is it fair you were born like this? No! You're a lean, mean, fighting machine !!
Meredith Mascitello November 21, 2011 at 11:21 PM
Jo, So don't call it an ism. Redistributon of private property by government force is not what this country needs more of. Compassion & caring can only come from individuals not bureaucracies. Sometimes the compassionate thing is for people to hit rock bottom. I don't believe it is compassionate to enable people's dysfunction. We fix this country by becoming better individuals. Our system has become corrupted because individuals are less virtuous. Because of the large size of the government, the corruption is harder to see and when seen, hard to stop. Society isn't made better by passing more laws because those who are not good don't obey the laws or find a legal way around it.
Jo November 22, 2011 at 12:51 AM
Meredith - who mentioned anything about "redistribution of private property by government force"? I sure didn't, & I don't think it's been mentioned in this whole blog. But the twisted thing is that it has already happened: over the last 30-40 years, loosened regulations, little accountability & tax favoritism for Wall St, is exactly how the middle class had their property stripped away from them. I mean houses, pensions, investments, personal security. You seem to be OK with charitable govt programs for Wall St, but not for the 99%... U spoke of people's dysfunction, their being less virtuous etc. That is another discussion (which I'd be willing to have another time). Don't you wonder why 1% of Americans own 40% of the wealth? This is a throwback to the late 19th century - early 20th. A wonderful middle class was created after WWII, and everybody had plenty (even the rich), but that has ended. No democracy can survive without a middle class. And THAT is my concern... that our current economic & financial system, which rewards money makers over societal health, has created a self-destructive condition that will affect even you.
Mike November 22, 2011 at 02:51 AM
Ox!
Mike November 22, 2011 at 03:13 AM
@MM: You forgot to cut taxes for the elite, er, job creators. Just like in countries like Somalia, there will be a few incredibly rich, almost no middle class, and a LOT of dirt-poor. I get your math, but what happens after the infrastructure disintegrates?
Gary November 22, 2011 at 01:14 PM
There apears to be questions regarding income. Here's an idea. Increase long term capital gains to 25%, let Bush tax cuts expire, remove $106K limit on payroll tax, increase SS age to 68 from 67, implement a windfall profit for any hedge fund operating with over $50M in assets, employ a transaction fee of $0.0001 on all trades, eliminate corporate loop hole allowing individuals to shelter income on a tax-deferred basis (not 401k, but actual income...and yes it does exist). How's that for a start all you who want ideas where to get $$$. And while we're at it, just to show I'm not a partisian but someone who's pragmactic. I would like to see the tax code redrawn so that it follows the the same distribution pattern as revenue, preferrably a Chi-Squared distribution.
clarke November 22, 2011 at 02:07 PM
The federal government takes in almost $2.4 trillion each year. That is more than enough, stop spending money that we don't have. Taxes are already too high, politicians have proven that they spend taxpayer money irresponsibly and shouldn't be given another dime to spend until they prove to the taxpayers that they can live within the $2.4 trillion a year that is already raised. How about them apples?
Jo November 22, 2011 at 02:16 PM
I would like to recommend a book written by David Korten: Agenda for a New Economy. It's not a hard read, but it presents many profound concepts & examines relationships. Our economic system is so broken that, although we need short term fixes just to survive (like an overhall of our tax system & getting Wall St under control), it is essential we start looking at the greater picture. Agenda for a New Economy is not a money book, but a healthy living systems book. A Wonderful Thanksgiving to All. But please, don't thank the founders who become the first Americans to invade other countries.
Gary November 22, 2011 at 03:30 PM
Let me try it this way FY2012 Budget is approx. $3.7T broken up into these major categories: Medicare-$851B, SS-$740B, Def-$629B, Domestic Spending-$740B, Income Security-$518B, and Interest-$220B. In FY2012 they expect approximation $2.6T in revenues yielding $1.1T in deficit. Given Medicare, SS, and Interest are mandatory payments that leaves us with $1.8T to close the deficit of $1.1T. So, if we eliminate the entire Federal Gov't and ALL subsistence to needy we get to your proposed "apples". Is that what you're advocating Clarke? Please, enlighten. If you note in my original post I at least offered up a restructure of Medicare and SS in concert with other revenue increases.
MadInNJ November 22, 2011 at 03:54 PM
The only Mandatory payment the government has to make is Interest on the Debt. Everything else is subject to debate, and legislative change.
Gary November 22, 2011 at 03:58 PM
Fair enough. So what are you proposing?
MadInNJ November 22, 2011 at 04:38 PM
Before we do anything, I'd like to hear what all the 99%ers think is "Fair." It's always a moving target as in, "we want more entitlement programs so The Rich need to pay (more of) their Fair Share;" or, "the economy is in the tank and we need to continue to cover all the current entitlements plus a few new ones, so The Rich need to pay (even more of ) their Fair Share." We need to nail that down first so we can establish a baseline to measure everything against, otherwise we will just continue the death spiral we are in. So the Question of the Day is - "What is Fair?"
Gary November 22, 2011 at 04:40 PM
Read my previous post I gave a litany of ideas....but here it goes again... There apears to be questions regarding income. Here's an idea. Increase long term capital gains to 25%, let Bush tax cuts expire, remove $106K limit on payroll tax, increase SS age to 68 from 67, implement a windfall profit for any hedge fund operating with over $50M in assets, employ a transaction fee of $0.0001 on all trades, eliminate corporate loop hole allowing individuals to shelter income on a tax-deferred basis (not 401k, but actual income...and yes it does exist). How's that for a start all you who want ideas where to get $$$. And while we're at it, just to show I'm not a partisian but someone who's pragmactic. I would like to see the tax code redrawn so that it follows the the same distribution pattern as revenue, preferrably a Chi-Squared distribution.
Steve Wells November 22, 2011 at 05:46 PM
And while you're at it, P, take time to read David Frum's analysis of his/your party that I recommended earlier: http://nymag.com/news/politics/conservatives-david-frum-2011-11/
Gary November 22, 2011 at 06:02 PM
First, in the spirit of full disclosure, while I originally registered as a Republican (and I must admit recieved my USAFA appointment from Jesse Helms) I am firmly entrenched with the Democrats (the fact I'm an Atheist in support of Gay Marriage and open service in the military makes me an anathema to "the Right"). Frum I would contend is the right of center version of my belief structure although I'm fairly sure (as the article you state implies) people on "the right" would consider him liberal. I've long advocated (as does my President *proud Obama supporter*) ALL parties have to contribute to the mess we're in right now. That means older Americans will see less Medicare/SS benefits than previous, Earned Income Tax may have to go for at least some period of time, Revenues must come from all parties but skewed towards higher income (especially those with a 8-figure wealth structures). O
Mike November 25, 2011 at 02:04 PM
@Gary: but with senior executives of Goldman, Exxon, Chubb, Merck, and all the other companies paying more in personal taxes, where will the money come from to hire people? This would cut the job creators off at the knees! And don't recite any of that hogwash about record corporate cash holdings, because that's all locked up overseas, as we all know.
Mike November 25, 2011 at 04:58 PM
@MadInNJ: I remembered your question at yesterday's Thanksgiving feast, I asked some more lib'ruhl family what they thought was fair. One idiot said something like this: "There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. You built a factory out there — good for you! But [let's be] clear: You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn’t have to worry that maurauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea — God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along." Now I don't know about you, but that's the biggest load I've heard (other than ObamaCare being a good thing). The 99% are truly an ungrateful lot.
clarke November 25, 2011 at 11:53 PM
As a self employed individual, my effective tax rate for federal and state is 40%, I think it would be "fair" if everyone paid the same effective rate. Government wants to waste 40% of what I make, they should waste 40% of what you make.

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